By David John Chávez, with Alan Quismorio
As part of the Substrate Arts Winter 2023 Pop-up held at Magic Theatre on December 5, Substrate Arts co-founder David John Chávez spoke onstage with The Chikahan Company co-founder Alan Quismorio.
David John Chávez: Hello, everybody. Good evening again. My name is David John Chávez. I’m one of the [founding] members of Substrate Arts.
Thank you for embracing the arts, supporting what we do, and taking in all of these wonderful dialogues that are happening tonight. So, from the bottom of our heart, thank you so much for coming out and showing your love and support for what we’re doing here.
This time, I want to bring up this lovely, lovely gentleman… So first of all, Alan Quismorio is a multi-hyphenate, who has been a theatre-maker for 40 years. His first big starring role was in kindergarten when he played a plum. And, if I know anything about Alan, he played the hell out of that plum.
He was also the artistic director at Bindlestiff Studio from 2011 to 2015. He was the co-artistic director of Asian American Theatre Company from 2008 to 2010. He is an alumnus of a Crowded Fire Theater, and—if it’s a theatre company in the Bay Area—he has been a part of that company in some way, including Oakland Public Theater, Brava for Women in the Arts, Shotgun Players, and, of course, right here on this stage at the Magic.
And, you know, during COVID, you either… lost your purpose or you found your purpose, right? And we decided we were going to find our purpose.
Two years ago, I got a call from a friend, Krystle Piamonte, and she said: “Hey, you know, this pandemic thing that’s happening and killing off theaters? Well, we’re gonna start a theatre company now.” I was like: “Wow, that’s some bravery right there. But if anybody can do it, it’s those folks over there [at The] Chikahan Company.”
…That’s when I first met Alan. We did a nice interview; we chatted a bunch; I wrote a story about them. That story got a zillion reads because I guess they made everybody read it and said go support us.
[Alan], Krystle, Ely Sonny Orquiza founded The Chikahan Company in 2021. And the aim is to be a professional company dedicated to telling authentic Filipino stories providing opportunities for regional Filipinx performers.
Well, you know, let’s go ahead and start off talking about that project, Chikahan. How are things going right now? What are some of the achievements that we can be boasting about right now, two years after we started?
Alan Quismorio: Well, so we’re in our third year, actually, going into our third year, which is very critical, right? Because this is when people start to notice and, most importantly, where your granters begin to take notice of your work [or ask:] What have you done in the last few years? Why should we give you, you know, this 10k or 50k grant, right?
So before we even realized that there was going to be a pandemic happening, Ely and Krystle and another theater-maker Marissa Ampon, we were thinking: Let’s put together another theater company—a company that’s going to focus on new works and you know, really revolutionary… rule-breaking works.
And then I was brought in, and then it was all just kind of talk or speculation and, you know, we were all very busy, we didn’t know what what’s going to happen. And then this thing, you know, COVID happened, and everything stopped. And, you know during COVID, you either… lost your purpose or you found your purpose, right? And we decided we were going to find our purpose.
Everything stopped, and it was a really great time to really think about this company we’ve been talking about for over a year, start laying the groundwork for it. And, you know, we were so glad that there was [the Innovator Incubator] through Playground that was able to help nurture all of that. So we’ve been with Playground for the last three years. Thank you, Jim Kleinmann, for saying yes to us for the last three years because it really helped us develop; we wouldn’t have been able to do it any other way…
But it was a very difficult road because, you know, doing even before COVID… the art or the state of theater was just on a tightrope. You know, theater companies have folded since then. You know, which is really sad, but through any disaster, you gotta find the light and all of it is the opportunity and that’s what we decided: We weren’t going to be defeated by, I guess, trends and by this pandemic… Theatre is risk, right? So we risked it and we went through it, but you know, it was a very difficult road.
“The Act of Care” was our first play through Playground, and it was a very ambitious undertaking. I think, actually I know, we bit off more than we can chew. But I think that we just wanted to just hit the ground running. So you know, thank you, Krystle Piamonte for doing the research to find all these Filipino artists that we would have never, like just kind of, known… but everyone involved in this production was Filipino or Filipino American.
David: And this was written by Conrad Panganiban and Lauren Andrei Garcia?
…it really taught us what, what theater was all about. You know, there is no safety net to it.
Alan: Yes. In themselves, they’re very great… I don’t want to say emerging because I know
David: Conrad’s been working for quite some time.
Alan: And I think that after a few years, you know, you’re no longer emerging, you should really be recognized and that’s what we did. We wanted to recognize these two playwrights. It’s so funny because they have very different voices, but they managed to come together and create this great, cohesive piece with big themes, you know. And, like I said, it was really ambitious because we did everything that we wanted to do in the first year. Oh, but, man, you know, the end product of it was… it really taught us what theater was all about. You know, there is no safety net to it. So that the next year, we had to scale down because all the things we learned from the first year, we needed some time to make it happen… all those lessons. And this year, we did three plays, one each night by a [different] playwright… and it was very successful!
David: Well, let me let me ask you a little bit more about some of the successes and even some of the things you learned. So I kind of joked about like, hey, theaters are closing and there’s no theaters. And you’re like: Well, we’re going to go upstream when everybody is going downstream. And we’re going to start this company which, you know, any starting of a theater company—especially in a cost restrictive region like the Bay Area—is always going to have its challenges. But, again, no one of us has ever experienced a global pandemic and how it affected arts organizations. So there was like double bravery on your side…
So for me, the question that I have for you is, knowing that theaters are struggling and knowing that people have found other things within that year-and-a-half… to do before returning to watch live plays, what has been the most challenging aspect of the work of your company, and what were some things you learned as audiences made it back to see what your company was doing?
Alan: Right. First in general, creating a theater company is hard because, who is your audience, right? And so, we thought, our audience is a no-brainer. Our audiences [are] Filipino Americans first and foremost, you know, who we want to honor with our storytelling. But we have to figure out how big is this Filipino-theater-loving community, especially in the Bay Area, right? Do they really understand theater? Can they really understand it enough to support a Filipino theatre company? So that’s our big challenge, and it’s still a challenge and we’re still trying to crack that code.
We just have to, you know, build it and hopefully they will come and they’re so lucky in year three, they’re finally coming.
There’s three of us, right? There’s Ely, Krystle and I, and we have Marissa who’s there but is taking a sabbatical [currently]. So it’s just the three of us because it’s a very simple operation, very skeleton crew. So we began as the three [artistic directors] and then we decided well, you know, why don’t I just take over as the managing director for now so you guys can take care of the creative side—and I can take care of the other logistics stuff?
So my concern, one of my concerns, is to figure out how to crack this code of getting Filipino Americans to come in and see the play. So we’re doing a lot of studies and research because, you know, if there’s any place that a Filipino American theater company should thrive, it would be in the Bay Area. But how do we get those [audience members]?
We just have to, you know, build it and hopefully they will come and… we’re so lucky because, in year three, they’re finally coming. With that being said, it’s still a challenge. You know, just getting, in general, an audience to come see theater because you know, the [theatre appreciation] is not as big of a priority anymore. It’s just becomes like a discovery that someone has when they become more mature and more sophisticated with their tastes like “Oh, I actually like theater!” but you don’t really see it… it’s not really, you know, taught as an appreciation when it should be… when we were kids, you know, when we’re in college.
David: Well, let me ask you this because I can speak for myself as a brown kid from Union City. My parents were not theatergoers, and I discovered it later in life. So did you grow up with theater?
Alan: I grew up theatrical! I was that kid who loved to play make believe. And I still wanted to play make believe, you know, after all my friends were just too grown up to play make believe. So, you know, I was glad that in Vallejo—at the time, it was late ‘70s, early ‘80s—there was a children’s company and my mom, you know, entertained my want to be part of this theatre company, and I got involved with that.
I was that kid who loved to play make believe. And I still wanted to play make believe, you know, after all my friends were just too grown up to play make believe.
The reason why I wanted to join [was] I saw a production of Oklahoma! And this guy came down the aisle on a horse. And I thought: “This is great, I want to be part of it, I want to be on a horse!”
So I joined the theatre company, and then I continued joining all sorts of drama clubs and theater, you know, local theater companies, and I was actually the only Asian kid in Solano County doing these things. I mean, I’ll make it even more specific. I was the only male Asian kid doing this, but I was young enough to know I could use it to my advantage. Right? …who can turn away a really cute Filipino boy, okay?
David: That would be difficult, right?
Alan: Yeah, like who wants to be in theater and who was very, you know, showoff-y and…
David: And played a plum?
Alan: Literally that was the role in the play!
[Laughter.]
Alan: So, I auditioned for roles and I got in, I got those roles. There was even one play where I was taken to the side and told: “Look, we have two roles that we want for you, you get to decide which one what you want.”
So I thought, huh, I want the lead… so I got the lead role! …This is before I really understood the larger picture of theater where, you know, a theater didn’t really understand how to cast actors of color. And what do you know? I mean, Solano County of all places, cast this Filipino boy in roles that you would not necessarily see an actor of color in. So in a way, in such a rural county, they were pretty progressive.
So then I moved to the city, you know, I did my first theater [job in San Francisco] at Exit Theater. And I got in, I got involved with some community activism theater, you know, AIDS awareness theater. And that’s where [Asian American Theater Company] found me, and they wanted me to audition for their plays which I did! So that was my entry into San Francisco theater.
David: But I do want to ask one more thing about Filipino narratives at this time. Right now, there have been some pretty high profile Filipino-focused productions. You know, you had “Here Lies Love” on Broadway, which I loved. I thought it was pretty amazing.
Alan: It closed early…
David: It closed early and there’s probably a million reasons why—we could spend two hours just about that issue right there.
I saw the show the day after they got the [closing] announcement. And it was so sad how they came to the stage door and they’re just like: If you could just tell people to keep buying tickets. They were really hoping it would be saved, and it deserved to be saved because it was incredible.
Yeah, you know, this is not a place for you to be afraid. It is not to be, it’s not a place for you to not take risks… and [you have to] show them that you have a voice, right? So, in that vein, I feel that Filipino American theatre should do the same.
Then one of our local performers, Moses Villarama had a pretty sizable role, so… I don’t know if anybody has gotten to see the Sara Porkalob show at Marin Theatre Company. I am saying right now if you get a chance it is unbelievably good. Like it just absolutely blew me away. There’s something very, very special about seeing a… brown woman just take hold of that stage, it was really special. And then the story itself, if you don’t know about this show, she does a trilogy of plays about the women in her family. This one is called “Dragon Lady” and this is for her grandmother and her grandmother’s travels from the Philippines to the United States… and she made her Broadway debut last year. And gave a very controversial interview about that debut, which, you know, was phenomenal because she was candid—she was honest. And you know, as journalists, we ask people to be honest, and when they’re honest, people are like: “We don’t want that much honesty, that’s a little too much that we’re dealing with here.”
So you have some pretty high profile Filipino narratives that have gotten onto, you know, Marin Theatre Company, one of five LORT theaters in the Bay Area,—obviously making it to Broadway in one of those houses. So the question I have for you, as someone who has been in theater as long as you have… for Filipino narratives, does it feel like this is a trend or does this feel like this has the power to really sustain and and really grow over time? Do you have a sense of how it feels?
Alan: I don’t think it’s trend; it should not be a trend. I think there is power now. So, I have a theater maker friend who has moved from the Bay Area to New York, Vince Marie Cuison, who also helped us put together Chikahan. And she’s there now and she’s a budding composer and always texts me and asks for advice because she feels othered in New York. You know, she’s in her early 20s, and I tell her there’s still a lot of fight in you and you cannot feel like this right now. It’s very important that you find that strength in yourself to kind of make your way through the New York industry because you are in ground zero for theater making.
This is not a place for you to be afraid. It’s not a place for you to not take risks, you know. Take risks, just disturb the conventions and traditions and show them that you have a voice, right? So, in that vein, I feel that Filipino American theatre should do the same.
I think that they should disturb, that they should get past all the conventions of just Filipino storytelling. I feel like there’s still all the writers out there who, when they do write, they still write to non-Filipino audiences. And that’s, you know, great if you want to do an entry-drug kind of production, you know, “[Hey look!] This is what Filipinos are all about.”
But if you really want to get to know Filipinos, these writers need to get past all that and really take the risk of being, you know, criticized or even appreciated, and accept all that.
So, going back to “Here Lies Love,” which is written by David Byrne, who is not Filipino, you know, he’s a pop music icon.
David: Fatboy Slim… Alex Timbers…
Alan: Exactly! And a lot of Filipinos took offense, well, Filipino theater-makers took offense that it was written by a non-Filipino or the people in the production were non-Filipinos. And Filipinos took offense because they felt like it was just glamorizing the Marcoses, right? I have not seen the play. I’m hoping that it makes it to the Bay Area because I want to see it. But I feel like this is an opportunity that we’re letting go. Despite the fact that you know, of all the bad stuff about it, there’s still a lot of good stuff that we need to sustain: which is that a Filipino story is being told, right?
I feel there’s a diversity in the story about well, is Asian American theater or Asian storytelling narratives, is it just a trend or a trend that sticks and, therefore, is that even profitable? If we think of theater as profitable then we are done for. Theater is, first and foremost, an art. Theater is about storytelling. And if we have to storytell to appease a general audience, then… what’s the honesty in that? How do we really tell about who we are as human beings, you know?
David: And theater is not New York, that is one place where they do theater.
Alan: But even in San Francisco, you know, your general audiences, they think of theater as New York. So that’s why BroadwaySF [and Broadway San Jose] are lucrative because [people think:] “Oh, this is a New York production—that we’ve heard so much about—is coming to the Bay Area and we have to watch it.”
That is theater, but it’s not local theater.
David: No, no, it’s commercial that is designed to make money.
Alan: But if you really want to see, and if you really want to encourage local theater, then you need to go see local theater. And unfortunately, because it doesn’t get any media coverage, you have to hunt it down, and you have to take a risk that it may not be as good as you think it’s going to be. But at the same time, you may find some really good gems.
David: We have those in the Bay Area. We have theater companies that consistently crank out incredible content in rooms, right? Not in, you know, the Curran.
Alan: And even the “rooms” are now disappearing.
David: Yeah, and that’s going to be the challenge.
But I think that you know, as local theater audiences, how you choose to see theater makes a difference. Who you support in theater makes a difference and even if you feel like: “Oh, well, you know, I don’t really like this show.”
Alan: And what’s also a bit disheartening for me was: a couple of years ago, I invited friends who I thought wanted to see theater. [I said:] “I don’t know what the show that we’re doing. It’s going to be in a small place.” And they were like: “That’s a small place, that’s not theater.”
David: Well, that’s I guess our job to teach them, and all of our jobs really to teach people what theater is. The heart of the Bay Area theater scene is not BroadwaySF. We know that. It’s the Magic, it’s Oakland Theater Project…
Alan: I think theater lovers need to bring their friends and really teach them what theater is about.
David: And theaters have to do a better job of reaching out to those friends to bring them in, and make those spaces welcoming for people of color. Telling them you’re welcome here…
Let’s go quickly with other news about the state of theater nowadays for you as a theater maker, someone that has seen the ups and the downs of this business. What encourages you about this moment in time?
Alan: So again, because of COVID, everything has been willy-nilly, but this is an opportunity to reset and redefine what theater is. To redefine who makes theater and who tells stories in theater. This is the moment when even an audience member makes a difference.
What stories are being told on stage? Let’s not even think about [New York]. I think New York is doing a really good job. I think there’s some stuff that’s coming out that’s pretty innovative. I can’t wait to see it come to the Bay Area.
But I think that you know, as local theater audiences, how you choose to see theater makes a difference. Who you support in theater makes a difference and even if you feel like: “Oh, well, you know, I don’t really like this show.”
It is not definitive of that theatre company. And you really have to see the gold flicks of an emerging theatre company. If I support that gold flick, I can find where that motherlode is and support that theatre company. It’s so funny because your politics plays into it, but don’t shy away from that. At the same time, don’t shy away from changing your politics a little bit. You know, challenge yourself. Really support your local theater.
David: I was asked that question as a critic. I was asked one time, because I see a lot of stuff but I don’t see as much as I can because, you know, my wife and three kids keep me a little busy. But I see quite a bit. And someone had asked me if I see a show at a smaller company, do you feel like you’re not gonna enjoy it as much as when you see a show maybe at a company with a bigger budget and the answer was absolutely not.
I enjoy what I see in the moment. And I’m glad you brought up “Oklahoma!” because, as someone that did not grow up with theater, I knew “Oklahoma!” was a play and there was a song. That’s kind of the extent of my knowledge. The first time I saw “Oklahoma!” was the Broadway revival in 2019, and it messed me up. It was unbelievably good. And the next day, I saw Hadestown the next day, and it was ok. Just because I couldn’t stop listening to “Oklahoma!”
Buy a ticket for a young person.
Recently, about a month ago, I saw a production of “Oklahoma!” and it was… bad, really awful, and I enjoyed the hell out of it. I did! I was singing along and I was like, “The surrey with the fringe on top!” and I was loving it… It was a high school company but all the high school kids were in their 30s because they came back to do the show. And I was like: “Wow, this is really bad but I had a great time.” And even though I love the revival, I still had a great time because, when you’re in the moment, you enjoy what’s in front of you…
Alan: You know, you can’t expect professional level theater at high school. You have to appreciate it for what it is. I mean, these are kids who love theater.
David: And this is their Broadway. This is their moment.
Alan: [And with the disapproval,] you’re like pissing over their love for this art.
David: Last question really quickly. What can we be doing better to cultivate an audience, especially young people—who are the people that we’re going to need to depend on to sustain this art form for the long haul?
Alan: Buy a ticket for a young person.
David: Oh, that’s good. I love that. I love that. Do we have any questions for Alan really quickly?
Audience question: …What is one aspect of [Filipino or Filipino American] existence that isn’t being shown? Or is really important to show?
Alan: The ugly part of it, right? I think that Filipinos, they want to see themselves in a good light because they feel so underrepresented and they feel like they’re under-appreciated… Whenever I see a name, an actor or a writer or whatever, whose name sounds Filipino, I want, I go to the internet. And I find out if they’re really Filipino and then, if they are, I celebrate that.
You know, it’s because we’re hungry. We’re hungry to be recognized and to be seen, but the ugly side of that is that we want to be seen always in a positive light, and that’s not always the case. Filipinos like any other demographic, you know, are varied in their social status, in their politics and in who they represent. And they agree and they disagree and sometimes to a very passionate level, right? That’s why I want to see. I want to see stories that really—not just challenge general audiences—but challenge Filipinos to look at themselves a little bit more critically.
Audience question: …I just came from the Philippines and I came from seeing a few shows there… [While attending a Q&A at the Cultural Center of the Philippines], they were acknowledging how they still struggle disseminating the art as well… They are still trying to figure out how e continue through the struggle of theatre companies existing…
When you ask the question of how we increase the knowledge of storytelling / theatre in general, do you think that / acknowledge that bringing it in schools [is in effective way of increasing access to theatre knowledge and appreciation]?
But—to support students to see that you can be an actor, to make that reality for someone in the province—you need to have theater in the province.
Alan: Any part of theatre, any kind of performance, bring [it] to the school because it’s an entry drug for the students. And going back to the question about the Philippines… I mean, I go to the Philippines maybe two or three years at a time, right, so I know the state of theater and a lot of the theater is based in Manila. And I’m sorry, but the Philippines is not Manila. It’s very hard for people in the Ilocos to go to Manila, for people from Cebu and Palawan to go to Manila.
We need more theatre companies in the Philippines to do these stories because otherwise, you know, I mean, it defeats just theatermaking… there are drama classes everywhere in Philippines. But—to support students to see that you can be an actor… to make that reality for someone in the province—you need to have theater in the province.
David: With that being said, again, I would like to thank everybody for being here this evening. It meant the world to have this conversation in front of such wonderful folks that are obviously supporting the arts. And Alan, I could talk to you about theater all day and the plan is at some point, we will get together all day and just talk about theater and it will be wonderful.
And also The Chikahan Company, please look them up and support, watch for their next show. Thank you, everybody.
Note: All Substrate Arts articles collected through live interview transcript are edited for length and clarity.
Alan S. Quismorio was Bindlestiff Studio’s Artistic Director from 2011-2015, overseeing the inaugural years of its new theatre space in the South of Market district of San Francisco. Previous to this tenure, he was Co-Artistic Director of the Asian American Theatre Company (2008-2010). He helped create AlchemySF, the emerging playwrights program at the Jon Sims Center (1999-2004) where he developed new works by Bay Area LGBT playwrights.
An alumni of Crowded Fire Theatre Company, he appeared in their productions of 49 MILE, SLAUGHTER CITY, and ONE BIG LIE. He HAS performed extensively in the Bay Area, with Magic Theatre, Oakland Public Theatre, Brava! Women in the Arts, Shotgun Players, and Word for Word.
As a director, his works include DOOLEY, THUNDER ABOVE, DEEPS BELOW, and, most recently, Theatre Rhino’s inaugural pop-up theatre production of THE UNDERPANTS GODOT. He was last seen in Theatre Rhino’s World Premiere of Boni Alvarez’s DRIVEN.